DevMeeting 2018-05-20

The site is still undergoing some design work.

Submitted by aerbax on Sun, 05/20/2018 - 14:38



Full Log

1:00 PM <rehrar> alright, meeting time!
1:01 PM <rehrar>
1:01 PM <rehrar> 1. Greetings
1:01 PM <rehrar> Who's ready to Monerooooo? Let me see you raise those hands and raise those voices!!!
1:02 PM <rbrunner> I don't know how to mooo
1:02 PM → serhack joined (1f9d7c0b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
1:02 PM <erciccione_[m]> whoop whoop
1:02 PM <serhack> Hi!
1:02 PM <serhack> Hi
1:02 PM <cryptochangement> rbrunner: only mooo can moo of course
1:02 PM <rbrunner> :)
1:02 PM <rehrar> Weak response. I said who's readaaaaay?
1:02 PM — +moneromooo looks on suspiciously
1:02 PM <@ArticMine> hi
1:02 PM <rehrar> *sigh* Monero isn't a rock concert, I guess.
1:02 PM <shortfinal> x
1:03 PM <endogenic> sort of here
1:03 PM <rehrar> moneromooo is a confusing name. It implies cow, but he's obviously the GOAT ;)
1:03 PM <vp11> lol
1:03 PM <rehrar> (just learned what that meant recently)
1:04 PM <rehrar> 2. Brief review of what's been completed since the previous meeting
1:04 PM <rehrar> Tell me, people. Watcha been up to? Increase our morale in the market of blood.
1:05 PM <serhack> Monero Integrations Team released the Monero Payment Gateway for Opencart, a popular e-shop platform.
1:05 PM <+moneromooo> More sync bug fixing.
1:05 PM → glv joined (~glv@2a01:e34:ed03:c7d0:b8d2:10a6:1568:afb8)
1:05 PM <rehrar> woohoo!
1:06 PM <+moneromooo> automatic popping of bad version blocks by stoffu (when the user doesn't update in time despite monerod moaning about it)
1:06 PM <rehrar> where are we at with 0.12.1? Mr. Potatohead said he'd be working on that this weekend, right?
1:07 PM ⇐ sneurlax quit (~r@ Ping timeout: 260 seconds
1:07 PM ⇐ lithiumpt quit (~lithiumpt@ Ping timeout: 248 seconds
1:07 PM <+moneromooo> fluffypony said monday last time. Whether this is the last delay or not, who knows.
1:07 PM <rehrar> 0.12.1 will eventually just become 0.13
1:07 PM <cryptochangement> iirc he said there's some git stuff to be done with reverting something and such
1:08 PM <iDunk> Hmm, he made an Asylum4You type thing for one of the PRs.
1:09 PM ⇐ NonaSuomy quit (~NonaSuomy@kodi/staff/TeknoJuce) Ping timeout: 250 seconds
1:10 PM <rehrar> anyone do anything recently? We been a bit slow?
1:10 PM <rbrunner> I started to program my MMS design for easy multisig. Progress is good so far, and I already know that the raw number of lines of code will be quite reasonable
1:10 PM ⇐ amiuhle quit ( Ping timeout: 276 seconds
1:10 PM <rbrunner> I even found a partner, or better said they found me: asymptotically (u/asymptotically508 on reddit) started to implement a first messaging daemon based on Bitmessage
1:11 PM <sarang> I finished up an analysis of noninteractive refunds and am finalizing coursework for my upcoming crypto outreach class
1:11 PM <rehrar> you guys are doing something really awesome!
1:12 PM <rbrunner> Is there an ELI5 for those refunds somewhere?
1:13 PM <sarang> Yes, let me pull up the link rbrunner
1:13 PM <sarang> Here's the link to the tech note:
1:14 PM <serhack> The Mastering Monero Resource needs some feedbacks on the content. If you want to help, please check out on
1:14 PM <rbrunner> Thanks, sarang, will check that!
1:14 PM <sarang> I'll put it in the MRL repo soon for further review
1:14 PM <sarang> I'll be working with some Purdue researchers on a more formal version for journal submission at some point
1:14 PM <sarang> it's a good collaboration
1:15 PM <sarang> Also, BP audits are underway still, nothing new to report
1:15 PM <sarang> funding is fully complete thanks to rehrar and the many generous contributors
1:15 PM <rehrar> still looking like completing on time?
1:16 PM <sarang> I don't foresee any delays
1:16 PM <rehrar> yay
1:17 PM <rehrar> also, thanks serhack for the Mastering Monero update
1:17 PM <rehrar> anything else fun to report?
1:18 PM <erciccione_[m]> the guide for the GUI is erady, we only need to implement it
1:18 PM <erciccione_[m]> rehrar: could you add a link for downloading the guide on the website as soon as 0.12.1 is out?
1:19 PM <rehrar> sure
1:19 PM ⇐ iDunk quit (~iDunk@unaffiliated/idunk) Ping timeout: 260 seconds
1:19 PM <erciccione_[m]> great, thanks.
1:19 PM <rehrar> alrighty
1:19 PM <rehrar> I think serhack has one more thing, and then we'll move on
1:20 PM <serhack> <- Mastering Monero Preview with some illustrations
1:20 PM <rehrar> thanks serhack
1:20 PM <rehrar> 3. Code + ticket discussion / Q & A
1:21 PM <rehrar> moneromooo, you wanna take over here? It'd be best if fluffypony was here to help out with 0.12.1 release stuff
1:21 PM → iDunk joined (~iDunk@unaffiliated/idunk)
1:21 PM <+moneromooo> I just wait for pony to have some time to merge, really.
1:21 PM → NonaSuomy joined (~NonaSuomy@kodi/staff/TeknoJuce)
1:21 PM <+moneromooo> I can answer if there are quetions about code.
1:22 PM <rehrar> Hopefully he can have the time. He does have a watch after all (as we were all reminded this week)
1:22 PM <rbrunner> lol
1:22 PM <vp11> ba-dum-tss
1:22 PM <gingeropolous> aw jeesh
1:23 PM <+moneromooo> No code question ?
1:23 PM <rehrar> Any questions for our emperor moneromooo?
1:23 PM <gingeropolous> uhhmmm... what needs the most testing?
1:23 PM <+moneromooo> atm, some private code. I might contact you later if you want to test stuff ^_^
1:23 PM <gingeropolous> ok
1:24 PM <gingeropolous> and, when are we gonna torture ourselves with another database reformat?
1:24 PM <+moneromooo> Also last two meetings, I said I had a wallet refresh speedup patchset, and asked if people could time the difference. AFAICT nobody did, so I guess performance is a non issue for people in general.
1:24 PM <gingeropolous> i timed the diff!
1:24 PM → ifntifb93 joined (c4342706@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
1:24 PM <+moneromooo> The v2 db stuff is just waiting for pony to release so we can merge to master.
1:24 PM <endogenic> moneromooo: private code? monero is so centralized
1:24 PM <+moneromooo> You did, but then I asked you specifically :)
1:24 PM <shortfinal> do we have a rough idea as to the next fork? month wise? I know that's sort of a joke considering we're still waiting on a point release. but this past fork I remember some discussion about moving the next fork further out, towards october
1:24 PM <rehrar> no no endogenic. We're supposed to be the most private cryptocurrency
1:25 PM <gingeropolous> no no rehrar , we're the most fungible
1:25 PM <endogenic> hey we should make the pow algo private too, that way no asics
1:25 PM <rehrar> oh I hope note shortfinal. Bulletproofs are coming in next fork.
1:25 PM <gingeropolous> hrm, so database reformat and bulletproofs for 0.13?
1:25 PM <endogenic> i heard a rumor bulletproofs impl has to be redone
1:25 PM <gingeropolous> lucky 13.
1:25 PM <endogenic> any truth?
1:25 PM <+moneromooo> Yay, I'm totally coding in a pub, with my laptop screen plugged into the sports screen. No privacy.
1:25 PM <sarang> endogenic: ?
1:25 PM <rehrar> can't we just have a 'NO ASICS ALLOWED' clause in the code of the PoW algo?
1:26 PM <endogenic> wow mooo that really narrows it down for us
1:26 PM — +moneromooo thinks again and does not feed
1:26 PM <endogenic> sarang: someone told me they heard that was a result of an audit
1:26 PM <sarang> oh lol
1:26 PM <sarang> that
1:27 PM → Lloydimiller4_ joined (~Lloydimil@unaffiliated/lloydimiller4)
1:27 PM <dEBRUYNE> I think sarang joked about that in the MRL channel
1:27 PM <dEBRUYNE> I can see someone taking it seriously though lol
1:27 PM <gingeropolous> re: timing, moneromooo  - i'll make a post on reddit to try and get some more testers. its on your fork called some branch something something
1:27 PM <sarang> BREAKING: no BPs
1:27 PM <dEBRUYNE> mswip gingeropolous
1:27 PM <dEBRUYNE> Also PRed I think (not sure if merged)
1:27 PM <rehrar> bullet proofs aren't bullet proof
1:28 PM <+moneromooo> Yes, that one, thanks. It does switch the db to v2 btw.
1:28 PM <@ArticMine> Someone fell for the joke
1:28 PM <gingeropolous> or is it mswipe2 dEBRUYNE moneromooo ?
1:28 PM <shortfinal> I'm falling for it right now, help. can't get up.
1:28 PM <shortfinal> lifealert
1:28 PM <+moneromooo> That one doesn't exist AFAIK. Joke again ?
1:28 PM <endogenic> dEBRUYNE: oh ok they were busy at the time so that could have been the case
1:29 PM → lithiumpt joined (~lithiumpt@
1:29 PM <cryptochangement> I opened up #3839 earlier for mining to subaddresses but stoffu said there isn't any demand for it so we shouldn't do it. do you have an opinion on that or should I just close it?
1:29 PM <dEBRUYNE> mswip2 gingeropolous
1:29 PM <gingeropolous>
1:29 PM <+moneromooo> It's whatever is in PR #3716
1:30 PM <rehrar> mining to subaddress is kind of cool, honestly
1:30 PM <rehrar> if I post my XMR address on the internet (for donations or whatever)
1:30 PM <+moneromooo> OMG, 19 files changed to allow mining to a subaddress :S
1:31 PM <rehrar> and then somebody goes to a pool and puts that XMR address in the pool software, if I mined on that site, then they see how much Monero I mined.
1:31 PM <cryptochangement> yea... that was also his problem
1:31 PM <endogenic> moneromooo that's just it
1:31 PM <vp11> rehrar, to be honest most people are mining in pools, and pool support to subaddresses is trivial (I think at least a few pools are already doing it)
1:31 PM <endogenic> multiply that by rebase work
1:31 PM <endogenic> afk
1:32 PM <rehrar> bai
1:32 PM <cryptochangement> it is basically that we shouldn't parse the mining address until we get to actually constructing the transaction so it slightly touches a bunch of files
1:32 PM <endogenic> see you
1:32 PM <+moneromooo> I'll read it later.
1:32 PM <rehrar> alright, move in?
1:32 PM <cryptochangement> ok thnx
1:33 PM <rehrar> *on
1:33 PM <rehrar> 4. Any additional meeting items
1:33 PM <rehrar> msvb-lab: wanted to ask something if I remember
1:34 PM <sarang> Oh, there was a recent proposal for time-limited outputs
1:35 PM <rbrunner> Saw it on reddit. Is that new, or has any other coin already tried something like that?
1:36 PM <rehrar> he doesn't seem to be around so I'll just paste what he said for people's information
1:36 PM <msvb-lab> Ups.
1:36 PM <rehrar> oh yay!
1:36 PM <gingeropolous> i doubt any coin has tried it. most coins can just prune spent outs.
1:36 PM <msvb-lab> Indeed, firmware development for the hardware badges has begun.
1:36 PM <msvb-lab> And so if any software developers here would like to learn to program embedded systems, they can make our badges light up.
1:37 PM <msvb-lab> So my question/request is for those who are interested in charlieplexed LED badge circuits to contact me if they want to create firmware.
1:37 PM <+moneromooo> Relatedly, back when there was talk about daughter chains, I was toying with the idea of having temporary daughter chains, which would live for, N months, a new one starting every N months, offset slightly. Move monero to it for daily use, then anything left moves back before it dies (possibly to the new temp chain, since offset).
1:37 PM <msvb-lab> I'll have a set of sneak preview badges in about a month to send out.
1:37 PM <msvb-lab> That's all, thanks rehrar.
1:37 PM <+moneromooo> and then nobody talked about daughter chains ever again for a long time :D
1:38 PM <sarang> lol
1:38 PM <sarang> I hadn't heard that idea
1:39 PM <rbrunner> As if syncing *one* chain wasn't hard enough already :)
1:39 PM <@ArticMine> Daughter chains that also use demurrage and are merged mined are something that is worth looking at
1:39 PM <rehrar> is dandelion tx stuff something that can be useful for Moruno?
1:39 PM <@ArticMine> For pr unable / expiring tx for example
1:40 PM <+moneromooo> harhar: you mean for monero ?
1:40 PM <rehrar> mrunooomo: ye
1:41 PM <rehrar> do people know what I mean when I say dandelion thingies?
1:41 PM <_Slack> <nanoakron> mooo - which PR is the wallet refresh timing one? I’m happy to test
1:41 PM <vp11> John Alan recently published in r/Monero about the core team GPG keys, mentioning that Riccardo's key ( isn't signed by anyone.
1:41 PM <vp11> As far as I'm concerned it's not a big deal, but since a lot of people this week are finding multiple reasons to defecate over our CEO (/s), I thought at least an explanation of why it's not a big deal could be provided by you, important people :D
1:41 PM <rehrar> sign via signal is the way to be
1:41 PM <gingeropolous> nanoakron: moneromooo> It's whatever is in PR #3716
1:42 PM <_Slack> <nanoakron> Thanks
1:42 PM <+moneromooo> 3716, and it does upgrade your db to v2, which means you always have to use the v2 patch with that db till it's merged.
1:43 PM <rehrar> just google Dandelion Protocol
1:43 PM <_Slack> <nanoakron> Hrm…
1:43 PM <rehrar> maybe for MRL to look at
1:43 PM <rehrar> but I think good amount of overlap with kovri
1:43 PM <rehrar> in terms of what trying to accomplish
1:43 PM <sarang> The Dandelion Protocol sounds like the title of a PG-rated crime novel
1:44 PM <rehrar> Baby's first crime thriller
1:44 PM <rbrunner> Hm, the links that come up on Google are a year old?
1:44 PM <rehrar> PIVX implemented it for a reason or other
1:44 PM <rehrar> basically to make it harder for malicious nodes to tell where tx are coming from
1:45 PM <sarang> Link to original paper:
1:46 PM <sarang> Looks like a fun exercise in sparse graph theory
1:46 PM <rehrar> just a thought
1:47 PM <rehrar> alright, nothing else?
1:47 PM <rehrar> confirm next meeting time?
1:47 PM <rehrar> #twoweeks
1:48 PM <rehrar> March 3rd. Any objections?
1:48 PM <dEBRUYNE> Perhaps endogenic could give us an update on MyMonero
1:48 PM <rehrar> he left
1:48 PM <dEBRUYNE> If he's not afk :P
1:48 PM <endogenic> back now
1:48 PM <iDunk> Why not January 3rd ?
1:48 PM <rehrar> hai
1:48 PM <endogenic> so the desktop apps are out
1:48 PM <endogenic> go download them on github?
1:48 PM <endogenic> !*
1:49 PM <ifntifb93> will mymonero be in fdroid?
1:49 PM <endogenic> the ios app is being reviewed by apple. they need extra time
1:49 PM <endogenic> ifntifb93: yes
1:49 PM <endogenic> definitely
1:49 PM <dEBRUYNE> Where's the announcement haha
1:49 PM <rehrar> they don't give you a timeline for that eh endogenic?
1:49 PM <endogenic> dEBRUYNE: we not launched yet :)
1:49 PM <dEBRUYNE> Also, I am saddened by the absence of a pre-announcement
1:49 PM <endogenic> well
1:49 PM <endogenic> this is it
1:50 PM <ifntifb93> great! is android apk available already too?
1:50 PM <dEBRUYNE> Oh perhaps you got me confused
1:50 PM <endogenic> the mymonero initial release offering
1:50 PM <dEBRUYNE> I thought the desktop apps were live already :p
1:50 PM <unknownids> woooo
1:50 PM <endogenic> ifntifb93: no i'm building the native app
1:50 PM <unknownids> mymonero ico buy buy buy
1:50 PM <endogenic> i'll make the android source repo public so someone can help
1:50 PM <cryptochangement> is it backed by the MEA tho?
1:50 PM <endogenic> yes
1:50 PM <endogenic> naturally
1:50 PM <cryptochangement> alright I'll go all in then
1:50 PM <endogenic> good
1:51 PM <endogenic> we'll do a secondary and tertiary offering
1:51 PM <ifntifb93> mea is great
1:51 PM <+moneromooo> The amount of bullshit *in a dev meeting* is wasting everyone's time.
1:51 PM <endogenic> said mooo
1:51 PM <iDunk> That's why I basically stopped reading them.
1:51 PM <rehrar> link to Github desktop apps?
1:51 PM ⇐ PuebloZag quit (506d1957@gateway/web/freenode/ip. Quit: Page closed
1:51 PM <dEBRUYNE> This I guess ->
1:52 PM <rehrar> great, thanks
1:52 PM <endogenic> well it seems this isnt the venue
1:52 PM <cryptochangement> looks like there are binaries and everything so it's official!
1:52 PM <endogenic> we may be spamming
1:52 PM <rehrar> and thanks endogenic :)
1:52 PM <rehrar> next meeting on the third
1:52 PM <rehrar> thanks for coming. Meeting over.